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branding for professional organizers

Episode 90: Branding + Websites for Professional Organizers with Brie Kistler

Sep 28

Whether you’ve had an organizing business for years or are brand new, today’s guest is offering so much wisdom about how your website and branding help you find clients and connect them to your business. Brie Kistler is the owner of BK Branding Co and she knows what it takes for an organizer’s website to show off the best of her to potential clients. 

Brie talks to us about the importance of branding to attract clients; the key parts of websites to best connect with your local audience; how testimonials can sell your organizing services; investing in your website and the confidence to invest in your business; and how websites and branding compare to using social media to market your organizing business.

brie kistler of bk branding talking about branding for pro. organizers
Brie Kistler of BK Branding Co

Time Stamps:

00:00 Brie and her business story
06:00 Key parts of organizers’ websites
08:00 How to communicate to clients via your website
10:00 Talking to your target organizing audience
12:00 Testimonials and how they sell your business
14:00 Branding
20:00 Investing in your website and ROI
26:00 You have 30 seconds to connect with your potential client!
30:00 Goals for local business
34:00 Websites vs. social media for marketing
38:00 Website building process

Links for listeners:

BK Branding Co website 

Information about our Inspired Organizer® program

If you are looking for business inspiration, we have a free workshop that is called The 4-Part Plan for Landing Your Dream Clients in 2021. Jen Obermeier leads you through that workshop. Sign up for that If you are interested in our Inspired Organizer® program, you can find us at


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If you are looking for business inspiration, we have a brand new free workshop that is called The 4-Part Plan for Landing Your Dream Clients in 2021. Jen Obermeier leads you through that workshop. Sign up for that If you are interested in our Inspired Organizer® program, you can find us at and don’t forget, we have a whole library of podcasts here, our YouTube channel, and  you can find us on Facebook and Instagram at Pro Organizer Studio.

Still not sure about starting your own Pro Organizing business? Cick here to read about the 5 things you need to know BEFORE starting your organizing business.

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Brie Kistler: I think it implants a lie in your head that business is too hard. I can’t figure out our website. So business is too hard.

I mean, there’s so many fears around starting businesses. I know. Cause I had them all. Everything is possible. It takes steps and it definitely takes finding people who know what they’re doing and who can support you so that you can really focus on what brings you joy and what you really want to do. 

Melissa Klug: I wanted to start today’s podcast with that absolutely awesome quote from our guest Brie Kistler. This is Melissa Klug. I am the Pro Organizer Studio Podcast cohost and I am absolutely thrilled to welcome our guest today, Brie Kistler. Brie used to work at Pro Organizer Studio. She is actually one of the reasons this podcast is in your headphones right now.

She was with Jen at the inception of the podcast and really helped get it out into the world. So we thank her for that. And now she runs her very own company. She is an entrepreneur and runs BK Branding Co, which is a company that builds branding and websites for professional organizers, which is one of my favorite subjects to talk about.

And whether you have been in business for four minutes or four years or 14 years, we have really good insights for you from Brie about how important it is for your website to attract local clients. I am very happy to have you on the podcast and let’s get you going.

Jen Obermeier: You’re listening to the Pro Organizer Studio Podcast with Melissa Klug and Jen Obermeier. Thank you so much for joining in our mission to broaden the horizons of savvy business women in the organizing industry by instilling confidence and inspiring authenticity. You’ll gain new insight into strategies designed specifically for professional organizers.

So now let’s get started.

Melissa Klug: We are back on the podcast with someone who is a great part of the Pro Organizer Studio family, Brie. How are you? 

Brie Kistler: Hi, I’m great. Thank you so much for having me. 

Melissa Klug: So a lot of our listeners will know Brie for any interaction that you’ve had with Pro Organizer Studio. Brie was a huge part of the family, worked for Pro Organizer Studio for many years, but part of her journey, which is super, super fun, and it’s one of those examples of, you never know where your life is going to go, she actually ended up starting her very own company and becoming an entrepreneur in her own right. And we are going to talk to her today about all sorts of things, websites, branding, all sorts of things that are important to professional organizers. Brie, do you want to give us just a little synopsis of your story?

Brie Kistler: Absolutely. I actually started a business right around when I met Jen Obermeier and I was interested in professional organizing. So I’ve had a short, maybe a year and a half stint of that. But I was moving around a lot, and so I, I ended up really connecting with Jen and helping her as an operations manager for almost three years and got really plugged into the Inspired Organizer group and met a lot of amazing women there.

And I realized while I was coaching and helping these women, that my favorite part of starting the business was the branding piece. Like figuring out, your colors and your “why,” your voice, your brand voice, and then your logos and your websites and all that stuff.

And I spent so much time, DIY’ing everything just because I loved it so much. And then when we’d be in the group, I, people would ask questions about loud feedback on my website, or can you help me with my logo? And that was like my favorite, I just loved giving feedback and input on that.

And I just found myself, in my own free time helping people with logos and wanting to do that so bad. So, as the operations manager, we had an opportunity to look for a web designer to refer our students to, and I swallowed my fear and asked Jen if I could, partner with her and, and start my own business and do this.

And then it’s just, it just took off from there. So now I’ve been doing it for almost two years now. And it’s just a huge passion. 

Melissa Klug: When it started as I’m and I, I don’t always like using the word side hustle, but it did start as a, like, I’m going to do this on the side while I’m doing other things.

And then it grew so much that you said, Hey, this has to be my full-time job because it is taking all of my full time.

Brie Kistler: Yes, absolutely. It was perfect for where my family was at.

I had a toddler at the time and I really wanted to be able to be available to her and work from home and everything. So it just really worked out to be able to do this and to help women start their own dream and their own journey into entrepreneurship, which is just so exciting to be a part of.

Melissa Klug: It is super exciting. I always love, and I mean, this genuinely, anytime someone writes in to the pro organizer studio group or anybody DMs us on Instagram, I always say, I am so excited that you want to be a professional organizer. And I mean, it so sincerely because it is such an amazing industry and we’re able to help so many people.

And there is something super rewarding about being able to help women start their own entrepreneurial journeys, because there are so many opportunities out there right now. Yes, 

Brie Kistler: Yes. And so many ways to do it too. I mean, there’s, it’s not just a cookie cutter industry. Every person, you gotta figure out some way to use their experiences to help others in, in this industry.

So that’s great.

Melissa Klug: Well, and I love one of the things I love about your story is, and this is something I embraced too, in the organizing world. Leaving yourself open to opportunity. You never know what kind of awesome thing might come out and sometimes just saying yes, or taking a leap, or like you said, swallowing your fear.

Like no matter what that is, there are awesome things on the other side of that. Yeah. So one of the things that I am super passionate about and, and you know that, cause we have talked about it privately before, but I am incredibly passionate about organizers and websites. And so that’s, this is what you do, branding websites, all of those things.

I just think that it is so, so, so important for organizers to be able to connect with their clients through the computer. I know that you could talk about this for hours, but tell me a little bit about what you see in organizing and branding and websites. In your business every day? 

Brie Kistler: I think it’s so important to not overdo it. Less is more and especially in your website, I think a lot of people can, overexplain and over brand and, just try to overshare and just really finding a balance of, good design, but also concise and meaningful story to bring everything together and really create a place that is welcoming.

But really your main focus is grabbing the attention of people who are overwhelmed and they want to see, very calm website, very calm brand, a calm face, a welcoming, friendly face. So there’s just a whole, it’s a whole thing of, of, of finding that balance and 

Melissa Klug: Well, and let’s talk, let’s talk a little bit about what you just said about sometimes our tendency is, and I know I had this too, and I, I still have it sometimes.

I want to tell you all the things about why organizing is great and why I would love to work with you and all those kinds of things. But you said something really important, which is the clients that are reaching out to you are overwhelmed. They are scared. In some cases they are ashamed.

And so finding a website that coms that, and isn’t overwhelming with information, even though there are a thousand things you’d like to tell someone, not overwhelming to them. I think that’s a really important point.

Brie Kistler: Yeah. I think your passion can lead you to, be so excited to share like all your experiences and all the ways you can help people and everything.

But if your purpose is to simplify someone’s life and , make space for peace in their life, and you need to have a website that communicates the same thing, and you can get to know them later, but, just have that, that initial connection needs to get to the point then, and not be overwhelmed.

Melissa Klug: So the other thing, I keep a post-it note on my laptop and I’ve, I’ve actually said this on the podcast before, but Jen, one time and it’s, it’s very simple, but sometimes very hard. The note just says focus on them because she and I were talking one time and, and just reminder that it’s about focusing on the potential client and what you’re going to bring them.

And thinking about how they might feel when they’re at the point where they’ve decided to reach out to someone, which may be the hardest step that they’ve ever taken and giving them an experience that makes them feel good and makes them feel welcome. Right. 

Brie Kistler: Yes for sure. I think, I think there is a balance of sharing a little bit of who you are, or at least like your sort of your vibe or your your background a little bit so that, the right people connect with you.

And so that you are also being fulfilled in, in your business, but for sure, not oversharing. 

Melissa Klug: How have you been able to see websites be able to connect with people? Because I know I’ve, I’ve seen it in my own business. Like, it is shocking to me that people that will say, oh, I felt like I knew you just because I read a little bit about your story and I’m sure that you see that too.

 And I think that maybe people don’t fully understand that. Like how are you able to communicate what a person is like through a website and the work that you do? 

Brie Kistler: I think if you think about. The things in your life that are overwhelming. Like if your target is busy, overwhelmed moms, then you’re a busy, overwhelmed while there you have been there.

And, really spending some time, brainstorming, what are the feelings that I have, or have had what are my pain points, and then asking questions, and speaking to those things in your website, so that when someone visits your website, they immediately feel known or seen or understood.

And. Quality over quantity was your web copy for sure. And I’m thinking about there being points, speaking to those and then offering solutions instead of, listing all your credentials and all the ways that you can help, all the reasons why you are so great.

Instead of doing that, just talking about, how you can really Come alongside somebody and really be a support to them. I think it’s so much more important. And then also I really think testimonials on websites are really important. I think they’re so great because I always tell my clients because so many people are like, oh, I want before and after photos.

And I really think testimonials are better because they speak to the emotion to the feelings and people can read through them and find themselves in someone else’s experience with you. And get so much out of that. I think your client already knows what your messy house looks like.

They don’t, they don’t need to see lots of messy and houses and tidy houses and they can go to Instagram for that, but your website can really be a place where you make an impact in a concise way. 

Melissa Klug: I am obsessed with a good testimonial. And I completely agree with you. I actually was coaching someone yesterday that, Hey, I know everybody thinks you have to have before and after pictures, but before and after pictures in general, never give you the idea of what the experience is like. They don’t convey the growth of the experience and they often don’t give you the visual wow. That you’re looking for. But a testimonial does a testimonial accomplishes all those things. The client themselves is telling what their experience is.

Brie Kistler: And then the specific attributes of that organizer that really meant the most of them. And so then, visitors to your website can see your character, and how you work, how hard you work, how service-oriented you are or how good with kids you are or whatever it is that’s important to your client.

They’re going to write about that. And then other people will will connect with that and really be attracted. 

Melissa Klug: I have found too with testimonials in my own business that, there were times that I was like, oh, I don’t really want to bother people and ask them, I don’t want to bug them.

 But people who are happy with your service are extremely happy to write you a nice review and a nice testimonial. And I’ve found is people sometimes tell you things about the process in that testimonial that you didn’t even know that they experienced.

So it’s actually like a learning experience.

Brie Kistler: I totally agree. I see. I see patterns for sure. Which is really affirming that like, oh, it’s not just one person who thinks this about me. Like, okay, this is, this is quality, a quality trait that I have that continues, but then there are different things that people say that I’m like, oh my gosh, I didn’t even know you were thinking that I didn’t know.

As good of an experience as you did, some people are more reserved during the process and then I’m not sure, and then they’re so excited and their review so 

Melissa Klug: and I think that being able to capture those and really give those as picking the absolute best testimonial and putting that on your homepage, that may be the thing that sells someone.

And it’s not a before and after picture. It’s that story that people tell and the story that you tell through your website. 

I know that you’re super passionate about branding and making sure that you have cohesive branding and that’s something I will say. I’ve not been the best at, in my own personal business.

I’m just going to be honest. I’m kind of all over the place, but I am very much understanding now how important that is. So can you talk to me a little bit about branding and how organizers go about that? 

Brie Kistler: Yeah. Oh, I think I understand what you’re saying, but speak to what you said.

I think you have a brand you have, very humorous, real, funny, great brands. I’m not your traditional sincere, authentic. I mean, it might not all be the same color, but that’s okay if you’re being yourself, 

Melissa Klug: I’m trying to reform Brie. I’m trying. 

Brie Kistler: I think it’s definitely a balance of, your visual branding, but also your, your brand voice and your copywriting and SEO. I mean, so much of it is so important, but I just love visual branding. I think, like interior [00:14:00] design is something that I wish I would’ve studied there and branding kind of fits in with that.

Just getting colors and textures and images and getting everything to meld together and beautifully and make sense. And like you said, be cohesive. That’s just something that comes naturally to me and I love it. And so with organizing I just think that it’s important because in a way it is kind of like, interior design and people want their house to be beautiful and welcoming and, calming and a sanctuary.

So, if you think about that, then it would make sense for, your organizing business to have those same, that same visual impact. And when you’re getting your business started and building everything out I think it is important to put some time and emphasis into figuring out what your color palette is and what your fonts are and making sure that everything makes sense together.

And if you’re going to have a presence on social media, that things are complimenting each other and that everything you post kind of has the same thread in, in, throughout it, and the reason it’s important is vs for one, you are showing your audience.

 Your style or, the, the quality of your service, the quality of your business, that you’re very professional. But also it helps your audience to get to know you and trust you and see like, oh, if they see a post or random posts, they’ll automatically know that it’s you. It keeps you in their mind, it’s funny, cause it’s like, oh, it’s just colors and fonts.

But it actually, it’s more than that because, it has an emotional impact on people. And if they think it’s beautiful and they like it, then they’re going to start recognizing your style, of your posts and everything and your website and even your business cards and other print materials and everything like people will start to recognize, oh, that is such and such.

That’s you know, so-and-so and they’ll, they’ll think of you more often when they’re talking to their friends or whatever, because that is something that’s appealing and aesthetically pleasing.

Melissa Klug: And I think too with branding it’s important. And you, you can tell me from your experience, but one of the things that I see sometimes with branding too, is while they need to be for your palette in particular, it needs to be something that resonates with you because it is your brand.

But it also thinking again about what is the client experience. Like I saw a website once where it was, very clear that the person’s favorite color was bright purple and that’s totally fine, like accents, a bright purple versus a very, it was a very jarring visual experience. And this is not a commentary on anybody’s color choices.

But just thinking about when you’re building that brand, what would best connect with a potential organizing client and what is that?

Brie Kistler: Absolutely. Absolutely. Like you don’t want chartreuse to be like, yeah. And like with purple. I mean, if you kind of think of it, like. Decorating your house. You’re not going to paint every wall, bright purple.

You’re not going to have every culture, every piece of furniture purple. Like you want to have a lot of neutral and then have accents of the color. But I, I also do think it’s important that okay, if you like purple, great, let’s use like lavender or like an eggplant or something.

That’s very calming. And that’s still electric because that’s not the point of your business, your point, your business is not to energize people. Like, you’re, it’s not a gym know you’re trying to calm the chaos in their house. So you want it doesn’t have to be pastel. It really doesn’t.

And I’ve done lots of different websites with brighter colors, but but yeah, definitely being careful about the color palette sees and, and it’s, if you are DIY it helps to just go on Pinterest and look up pallets and see. What looks a little more soothing, 

Melissa Klug: just scroll through whether it’s Pinterest, Canva, anything, you can get so many great branding ideas from that and, and say like, Hey, this is a color story that really speaks to me.

The other thing I’ll say about branding, keeping branding consistent, it makes your decision-making. ’cause you don’t have to say like, oh my gosh, there are 72 trillion colors out there. I can pick, what am I going to pick for my Instagram post today? You just go like, no, I’ve got four colors. 

Brie Kistler: And here’s, if you have the Canva, account like the paid Canva account, then you can set up your brand colors.

And they’re always there. You don’t just type in code every time. It’s always there. And same with your fonts. You can just save, save it all there. And it makes it so much easier. And you can have templates that you use and you can definitely cut out a lot of decision-making decision fatigue and a lot of time just by, setting those things up.

Melissa Klug: One of the things that you and I have talked about before is, and I will say at the beginning of my business, I was definitely full DIY. I was like, Nope, I can do this myself. And I honestly didn’t, this is going to sound silly. I didn’t really fully understand there were people out there that could help.

Anything. And so, I do understand, sometimes there is the, the DIY moment, but one of the things that I wish I would have gotten much earlier in my organizing business was there are people that can help with things. And it is an investment in your business that is going to save. Well, sometimes, literally hundreds of hours of your time.

And a lot of wasted time of not being able to go out and get clients because you are figuring out how to use Squarespace. If someone is hesitant like, oh, I don’t know that I want to spend money on, branding or website, like give us a little bit about your experience with them.

Brie Kistler: Yes, yes. I mean, yeah, I was definitely the DIY bargain shopper girl and had a lot of fear and, low confidence, lack of confidence about money. And. Just just scared to spend money scarcity, just afraid that anything I spend or do, it’s just, it’s not going to come back to me.

 And I came into, like I got to know program coordinator, studio when I was feeling that way. So I started my professional organizing business DIY absolutely everything. And it’s fine, but it takes, it takes a lot of time.

And it’s frustrating to a lot of people because you’re having to learn new programs and a lot of the times figuring out your colors and figuring out, your, your branding, it doesn’t come naturally to you. But you feel like you have to do it yourself because it’s expensive.

 But as I have grown in my business and, spent more time figuring out what really makes sense to me and what I enjoy doing. And also just putting action into working with my clients. I mean, it really does help you build confidence around.

What your strong suits are. And then you start to realize that you can let go of some of those extras that are just taking up your time and, and frustrating you. And so, website is one of those things, because when you’re getting started with your business, you have. Positive, excited, creative energy toward it.

It can really suck you dry to spend weeks, months a year. I mean, some people just cannot get past the branding side of things. And then they’re like, well, it has to look a certain way or, I have to have the right name or I have to have the right color. I have to have the right photos.

 I have to have it. Perfect. And then, they’re spending so much time focusing on that and they’re losing that drive that passion to actually do the thing that they’re wanting to do, the organizing, the connecting with people and, and making an impact in people’s lives.

So I think it’s a huge thing to let go of some of the things that you aren’t as good at early on. And do. And just let someone help you get it done quickly so that you can actually dive into what you’re actually passionate about 

Melissa Klug: and start helping people. I want to go back.

Cause I think one of the things you just said is like total. Hard-stop brilliant, which is, there are parts of building a business that if you let it discourage you, it will stop all of your forward progress. And if you are struggling to, you don’t enjoy learning Squarespace and you don’t know how to do it, and you don’t know how to do branding.

It can stop you from actually like getting started on your business journey and letting that prevent you versus finding someone to help you with it. I, that it was like an awesome thing. 

Brie Kistler: I think it implants a lie in your head that businesses do hard. I can’t figure out our website. So businesses too hard.

I mean, there’s so many fears around starting businesses. I know. Cause I had them all, especially when you’re, you’re a mom and you’re, you have all these things you have to think about. And then you’re scared about like setting things legally and setting things up digitally and all these things.

Everything is possible. It just, you can’t try to do it all. You can’t try to do it all all at the same time and it takes steps and it definitely takes finding people who know what they’re doing and who can support you so that you can really focus on what brings you joy and what you really want to do.

I picked Squarespace because it’s easy for you to maintain afterwards, but if you can’t figure it out on your own, there’s nothing wrong with that. It’s a website, you’re not a web designer. You’re an organizer, so, 

Melissa Klug: I always say, just because you can do something doesn’t mean you should do something.

You can do all these things.

You can build a website yourself, even if you’ve never done it. That doesn’t mean it’s the right choice for you, or it’s the right way to spend your time. Or if it is going to take you a hundred hours, think about, I mean, minimally, it could take you a hundred hours, no idea what you’re doing and you’re searching for the perfect picture.

And you’re trying to pick the perfect font and you can get into analysis paralysis very easily because there are literally thousands of fonts and pictures and everything. And so 

Brie Kistler: if you’re going to spend a hundred coffee dates with power partners to talk about your business, 

Melissa Klug: let’s just say, it’s going to take you a hundred hours to build your website.

And if you’re going to charge clients a hundred dollars an hour for your time, you can do some simple math and say, oh, it cost me $10,000 to build this website. What would. A fraction of crap. And I often think this is something that I, I struggled with too, is I made assumptions about how much something was going to cost without ever doing the research.

And so you might think, oh, it’s going to cost me so much money to build a website. I can’t afford it. It’s not, it’s not a, a huge, huge expense. And it’s the deductible for your business and get you into the market faster so that you can get clients and have them pay you. The ROI is outrageous. 

Brie Kistler: Yes, totally. Yes. And more beautiful if I may say some myself, literally, I, yeah, I mean, DIY websites are great. Like, I, I also do some audits for people, and there’s just, there’s little things you can tweak that really make a big difference, and so if you just have someone do it for you, like you can just skip over that and just move on to the next thing.

Melissa Klug: And I think, especially when we’re talking about who is your ideal client, a website needs to talk to the. Potential client. So if you are focusing on really a high-end luxury client, your website needs to convey that feeling for focusing on a busy, overwhelmed mom who steps on Legos 400 times a day, your website needs to convey the message to that person directly and having a professional give you that.

 Well, one of the things I love everything you’re saying about, I mean, less is more, I have a, a thing on my shelf that says less is more cause I have to remind myself about that sometimes, but it’s so important and organizers websites, and one of the things that was just so shocking to me when I first started my business is, and I know that the statistics change all the time, but you have less than 30 seconds and sometimes less than 10 seconds.

To grab someone’s attention enough to stay on your website. And so one of the things that I see sometimes , there are, 12 tabs at the top and that you have to click to find everything right?

And I go, an overwhelmed person’s attention span is going to be very short. And so you have to hook them in immediately and they may only ever see your homepage. They may scroll your homepage and that’s it. And they never click on the, all the glorious things that you have in those other tabs.

And I’m sure they’re amazing things, but they’re not going to get there. And so one of the things about working with an expert and experienced person like you, is, you know what it’s going to take to grab someone’s attention and create that story and create that connection with you, that personal connection of I’m hiring you to work in my personal spaces.

Brie Kistler: Definitely keeping things simple. The KISS method is definitely important here, I think. And yeah, a lot of our websites, the navigation bar at the top, it looks really the same, there’s the same, like four to six pages, but it’s what they need to see.

Like, you could have tons of resources and videos and, lists of donation sites. Most people will ask you for that. They’re not in your clients. Aren’t going to keep going on your website. They go on your website to hire you and then you can give them resources separately, that’s just my opinion, but I think it’s important to sort of your website is to get them from.

Meaning you to hire you, and so a lot of times it’s really, on page about page services. Like I do it in order. It’s like, I want you to see the homepage have, access to all of my pages. The homepage is like the intro and the hub. You know of the rest of the site, and then you have the about page because you want them to learn more about you.

Services is, by your services and rates, rates is important to have on your website. Maybe some testimonials and then a contact page. I mean, it’s very simple. It doesn’t have to be ever done. But the point is, it’s a [00:28:00] journey either. You’re bringing them in on a journey through your website and yeah, you definitely don’t want to over complicate that journey 

Melissa Klug: When people work with you. They have some homework, they have some questionnaires, but then you distill those down. And I think that that distilling down processes, we’re not good at editing ourselves. Right? But you need someone from the outside to say, I promise you, this may feel uncomfortable, but this is the right way to go.

Because we know we have seen before what works and what doesn’t work and letting go a little bit of that control and saying, I trust someone who has expertise in this and I’m going to let go of that control. Super, super important. Yes. Yes. 

Brie Kistler: And like I said, I mean, I work on with my clients.

 And sometimes they help me edit things when I get too excited, but but yeah, I definitely agree. Sometimes. I’m just like, you’re just going to have to trust me on this. Like you wait until you see it.

Trust trust the process. Absolutely. 

Melissa Klug: Can we talk a little bit about one of the other things that I am super passionate about teaching organizers is the importance of, so it’s not just having a website super, super important, but also making sure you have the right keywords on there, making sure, the whole point of Google existing is we’ve got Jane who needs organizing services and Susan that provides them.

And we’ve got to put those two people together out of the huge world of the internet. And one of the ways we do that is by SEO and keywords and all of those things. 

Brie Kistler: Yes. Yes. I have a wonderful SEO expert partner with me. And she actually a professor in SEO in, in Pennsylvania. 

So I definitely love having her in my back pocket. Like Google’s very picky. It’s very finicky. Google doesn’t want you to overdo it. But so again, less is more but you know, finding the right places to add those keywords is really important.

Especially because most professional organizing businesses are local businesses. And so when your emphasis is on, finding your clients locally, it’s really important to make sure that Google knows where you are so that you can start ranking higher in Google, on Google search.

And, and SEO is definitely a process. I mean, it takes time. It’s not something that’s gonna happen overnight. Like building a website can happen really quickly, but building your presence online is definitely takes months. 

Melissa Klug: This is a super, super great point because one of the things that I see sometimes, unfortunately I have to hurt people’s feelings sometimes and say, you launched your website last week. Yes. You’re not at the top of the Google search results. It takes time. And so, and that’s, that’s the thing is like, I think we have this idea that you just put a website out there and magically are going to find, and it takes, listen, Google’s crawling billions of websites.

And so it takes a while for Google to recognize your website is out there to know what you do to be able to do that matching process. And so the more time that you take. Struggling with perfection, perfection, itis, or any of those other things, and 

Brie Kistler: that process of Google doing it.

Melissa Klug: Absolutely not going to be able to find those ideal clients because they haven’t had time to be able to find you on the internet. So it’s just another example of you might be losing thousands of dollars because you’re delaying this process. 

Brie Kistler: Yep. Yep. I agree. 

Melissa Klug: Another thing too, even if you’re not an SEO expert, one of the things that we talk about a lot is just make sure that you’re using to Barry’s point less is more using very plain language to talk about what you do also.

So there are experiences we provide to clients which can be articulated easily. But at the core of it, we need to connect with people on Google. And by doing that, we need to use the words they would use to search for. Yes, yes, 

Brie Kistler: yes, yes. You’re not a poet. You’re not a poet trying to get people to find you.

And so if they’re going to type, Type in something, I don’t know, like overwhelming sanctuary, I dunno. They’re to search declutter my closet, so yeah. Yeah. Or, 

Melissa Klug: yeah. Curating a sanctuary, not going to be the Google search, but organize my crap, my search. Right. So, 

Brie Kistler: yeah. So you, that means that you have to actually speak that.

There’s a balance of speaking in your brand voice, but also using the terminology that is going to help people find you. 

Melissa Klug: Jen and I have a business coach who have the, the one thing that I will always take from her is use second grade language. That’s her sentence that she used, she’ll be on a coaching call with someone who’s like trying to build something.

And they’re like, well, I do blah, blah, blah. And she’s like, that’s not second grade language. And I love when she says that, because it’s just a reminder of like, okay, yeah, I’m, I’m using, I’m using words that maybe my potential clients wouldn’t hear. So, yeah. Yeah. And a good 

Brie Kistler: way to kind of figure that out.

Like, speaking of how to explain what you do, 

the Don Miller’s StoryBrand teaches that, like learning, figuring out what your one liner is . Just talking about how like, Solution you solve for whatever person’s problem.

Melissa Klug: I would totally recommend I’m obsessed with StoryBrand. So Donald Miller is a marketing expert and business builder and all sorts of other things. And he has a book called StoryBrand that even if you’re not quite ready to start a website building journey, or you’re just thinking about a business or frankly, even if you’ve been in business for five years or 10 years, I think it’s an incredibly valuable book. And it’s a good exercise to go through. He will walk you through in this book. How do you think about your business? How do you talk about your business? And it’s actually, it would be a great step to take, to read that and do that work and then 

Brie Kistler: engage. I agree. I think it’s a great, like if clients read it before they fill out my questionnaires for copywriting, that helps so much [00:34:00] because then they kind of have the better understanding, like why they’re doing what they’re doing and what the.

Melissa Klug: Their clients are facing, and then they can kind of say that more concisely. So it’s an absolutely great book and I definitely recommend it. 

So, one of the things that I think a lot of organizers believe is that social media like that’s how they’re going to find all of their clients. And I know you and I definitely align on that is a nice to have, but your website is what really gets people.

Brie Kistler: I do think it’s important to make sure that your website 

Melissa Klug: Is your 

Brie Kistler: first priority. So many people will jump on Instagram.

They’re like, oh, this is where all the pretty pictures are. This must be how I get business. But it’s important to kind of step back and think about what your priorities are in your business. If you, really do want to sell products through your affiliate, to write blog posts, to be an influencer in the industry, that’s one thing, and you can really start building up your community on social media that, for that reason.

But if you really do want to focus on local business, and being in people’s underwear drawers, then you need to focus on. Making sure that your website reaches them. And social media, it’s so popular. And so there’s a lot of pressure to be on it, even if it’s something that you’re putting on yourself, that pressure.

But I think it’s really important to kind of figure out, like I said, what your purpose of your businesses, but also what brings you joy and how your personality is going to play out in your business, because you don’t want to be someone else you don’t want to copy what someone else is doing because they’re successful.

That’s not the recipe for success. I think that successful people do what brings them joy and then their audience can. Their audience feeds on that, then, and they’re attracted to that and they want to connect with you because you are being true to yourself. And and then.

Success comes from that. I’m not saying that it’s magic, that it’ll happen overnight, but I think it’s important to make sure that you’re connecting with the 

Melissa Klug: right people. Yeah. And where your ideal client is hanging out. And I love your point about if your goal for your business is to be, if you are selling a course, if you’re selling an online program, if you are selling products, if you want to be an influencer, all of those are great points so your client then is hanging out on Instagram.

And so Instagram will become a very important part of your business. But if you want to organize in someone’s closet, And Dallas, Texas, the way to find those people is to create your brand and to create your website and get your Google, my business going and get that piece developed. And then there’s a phrase that our inspired organizer friend, Kate Jones uses, which is social net becomes proof of life.

So your social exactly, it is proof that you are out there and I’m not saying don’t build it, but concentrating only on social media and then forgetting about this other piece. If you are building a local business, 

Brie Kistler: Yeah. Yeah. And I mean, you can spend so much time, like trying to post every day and trying to say something meaningful.

And if it doesn’t come natural to you, then you’re wasting a lot of time. Because if what comes natural to you is connecting with your clients one-on-one and not so much, being a face on Instagram then you need to focus on that. You need to focus on what, what feels authentic to you and you can post.

Occasionally, you can post a couple of times a week and just, show that your businesses alive and growing. And you can also outsource those things. I think that’s so important. Like you don’t have to do it all yourself. You can, you can figure out your style and what, what looks good to you and what feels like your brand.

And then you can hire a copywriter to write your, your captions. You can hire a designer to create your posts and all this stuff. Like it’s all doable, it’s all doable so that you can feel relevant, but really focus on your strengths. 

Melissa Klug: Tell me a [00:38:00] little bit about the process of building a website. So if someone is saying like, well, I don’t really know what I want to do, but I don’t know how I would convey all of this to you. What is the process of building a website with you?

Brie Kistler: Well, when I first started, I kind of, I think I did like what most designers do. And I did this traditional process of working with client for four to six weeks, it was this long drawn out thing.

And they would have these questionnaires and this homework to do, and then we would slowly work through the project. I realized that I had a lot 

Melissa Klug: of people wanting my help, 

Brie Kistler: which is a huge blessing, but I needed to help more people in less time. And both for me and for my, personal needs.

But also so that you guys can really get started quickly. I adopted this whole day rate model. And I started working with clients by the day. And I’m able to now focus on one person at a time and, we get on Facebook messenger and we chat back and forth and they see the progress and everything.

But but to answer your question, getting started. Yeah. There is homework that needs to be done. Sometimes it’s really overwhelming for people, but you can take as much time as you need, before we actually do the work. And there are some questionnaires, and I ask people to make a Pinterest board for me to show me like their style, their colors, that they like, their fonts, that they like logos business cards, interior design photos, and organized space photos, just for me to see their style, their vision, what kind of spaces they think they want to create or what they want their business to exude, that vibe.

And that helps me a lot. That’s probably the most important thing for me to catch hold of their vision. But the process itself really, well, obviously I do it, all the time. And so for me, it’s like no big deal. I think people tend to get a little overwhelmed and then I’m like, it’s okay.

Like, it’s okay. If you need to trust the process, just do the homework and I know what you need. It’s a lot of, building and then a lot of editing, a lot of, lessons more and that, includes, all the content people upload for me and our shared files for me to use.

 I’m very picky about what I use, and, and the same with, if you hire one of our copywriters and they’re probably not going to, it’s going to be simple, it’s going to be, not so wordy or sometimes the questionnaires are so full and it’s helpful for sure. But we definitely break things down into very simple, minimal websites.

My websites are definitely very minimal beautiful, but yeah. Overwhelming and layered and that’s something that, I’ve had, I’ve struggled with a little bit. I think I felt like, oh, I’m not good enough because it doesn’t look like I’m a super, like a creative business website, but that’s the thing.

It’s not a creative business website. It doesn’t need lots of layers. It’s, I’m not working with artists. I’m working with, I’m working with organizers and it needs to be very calming, very minimal. And also the flow of the website’s important too, so your visitor can, find the information they need quickly. And so that your conversion rate will be as high 

Melissa Klug: as possible. 

We have covered so many things today. I can seriously, I could talk to you about that.

I’m not joking. I could take your entire day to talk about this. If you’re busy and I know you have other things to do besides talking to me. Oh, my gosh. Thank you for joining us for this felt like a little bit of a throwback because Bri worked on the podcast for, I mean, you were like there, when 

Brie Kistler: it first died, birth birth to the podcast,

Melissa Klug: people should thank you because people say all the time. Oh my gosh, I love the podcast. And I’m like, I didn’t really, Brie was at the inception. So we should thank her for putting this out. Thank you so much. I’m so 

Brie Kistler: glad it’s been so encouraging to so many people.

Melissa Klug: Yeah. It’s just, it’s an awesome thing that that Jen decided to start and you made it happen and it’s awesome.

So can you tell people how they can work with you and how they can find you

Brie Kistler: yes. 

Melissa Klug: If you don’t have a website, we’re going to have a problem.

Brie Kistler: Just kidding. No, I definitely do. My website is that’s the name of my business, and I, you can also find me on Instagram at @bkbrandingco.

Melissa Klug: I definitely encourage you to check out all, all of, all the different places that Brie lands, because it really gives you an idea of what the aesthetic that she brings to your organizing business.

And we only recommend people that we truly truly believe in their services. And I have seen many, a breeze website, so people in or Inspired Organizer program that use Brie and so their websites are absolutely gorgeous and she knows exactly what the clients are looking for.

So, totally 

Brie Kistler: thank you so much. This was so fun. 

That is all that we have for you today on this episode of the Pro Organizer Studio podcast, if you have not yet joined Jen Obermeier for our free workshop, your four-part plan for landing your dream clients in 2021, hop over to and we will get you that workshop on demand. It’s a great way to spend an hour of your time.

Thank you so much for listening in to the pro organizer studio podcast. If you’d like to get our roadmap for success as a pro organizer, head straight to

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Photos of jen by ANGELA ZION