2 Years in Her Professional Organizing Business: Kim of Rustic Home Organizing
“If you would have told me at the end of year two, what I would have done— like, the money that I made in year one versus the money I made in year two, and the growth in my confidence and just people knowing about me, knowing what I do the people I’ve met, the relationships I’ve made starting to build a studio on my property—
I mean, it’s crazy. Absolutely nuts. Absolutely.”
I first interviewed Kim two years ago when her business was BRRAAANNNDD new. In her first year, once she got paid by a client with a dozen eggs. Fast forward two years later--and she had her first (and second, and third) $10,000 month in her business, Rustic Home Organizing.
Kim is giving us all the details on her second year in business--and no matter where you are in your organizing business, there is so much to learn here!
This interview originally aired as an episode of the Pro Organizer Studio Podcast. If you would like to listen, You can LISTEN HERE or find us on Apple, Spotify, or anywhere you love to listen to podcasts!
Kim Snodgrass of Rustic Home Organizing in Portland, Oregon.
FULL TRANSCRIPT
Melissa: So two years ago, I had an idea. We had someone brand new in our Inspired Organizer course, she had joined because she was just starting her business. And I said, “oh, I want to interview her.” And you know, maybe she'll come on the podcast and just talk about how she decided to be a business owner and what she was doing.
And then a year later, almost exactly to the day I interviewed her again to hear how that first year went and then a little over a year later, I sat down with her again, and then I got to hear what was her second year like.
Your second year is a very different phase of your business.
You really are kind of honed in and you know what you're doing. You're not brand new anymore, but you're still growing. I very much look at business ownership as like the stages of having a kid. Like you're a brand new business owner—your business is an infant. It's crying a lot. You're trying to figure it all out. You don't know really what you're doing. Then when your business baby is a year old, you start to know a little bit more. They're walking, they're starting to talk. They're definitely learning, but In the second year, you know, your baby really well at that point, you know, their moods, but they're still a little kid and they still need your help and they still need your support.
So, anyway, I am thrilled to bring you my friend Kim Snodgrass of Rustic Home Organizing. She is going to be talking to us about what her second year has been.
There are things that are a part of anybody's journey, no matter where you are an organizing that are relevant to people at very different stages. If you're brand new in your business and you're like, I can't relate to someone who's been in business for a couple of years. There are still amazing things in here that you can draw from it. And then similarly, if you've been in business for 10 years or five years, or you really are kind of cooking, we still have good things in here for you to to think about.
So I would love for you guys to read about Kim's journey. We talk about all sorts of things.
All right. It's time to get this party started meet, or re-meet my friend, Kim of Rustic Home Organizing.
Melissa: Okay, so this is the third time that we have talked.
But I wanted to do this—you’re so gracious that every year you're, you are very nice about, yeah, sure. I'll talk to you again about like how this year went. And I actually love that we have this chronicle of like baby organizer you, and then one year old organizer you, and you're a two year old organizer.
So you're throwing some tantrums and you're learning all the things. So I'm just, I'm so excited to be talking to you about how this last year went.
Kim: Well, I'm excited to be talking because that means I'm still in business. All right, which is great, and I definitely grew this year, so I'm excited to talk about it.
Melissa: Well, so last year when we talked, you had learned a billion things. Like, I think your year zero versus your year one, you learned a lot of things really, really quickly. How did you feel about year one through year two? Did you feel like you were learning as fast, or like, how did it feel different to you?
Kim: I think I was learning as fast. I think I was learning differently. I think I was a little more analytical about the things that I was taking in and digesting them and putting them within buckets in my brain and trying to figure out really what I was listening to, watching being jealous of, being spiteful of, like all of those things.
I really dug a little bit deeper internally this last year. And I think that's the biggest change in how I learned.
Melissa: Can you talk a little bit more about that? Because that one of the things that we have talked before about is comparisonitis and all those things and looking at, just assuming what other people are doing.
Tell me a little bit about your growth.
Kim: Right. Okay. Number one, I'm gonna, I'm gonna turn back around to social media because that has been a learning curve for me and it has somewhat evolved and I think it has found its place in my life and in my business, finally.
Which is something that I want to pass on to anybody getting into this business is how social media is going to be a part of your life. It doesn't have to be a part of it, as we've talked about, but for me, I have decided to let it be a part of my life and my business life. And I use it for exactly that socializing.
Kim is the owner of Rustic Home Organizing in Portland, Oregon.
I 100% still use it for socializing. I have it dialed in. I reach out to local people, I reach out to people other organizers with throughout the country. I have made some great friends. I have a mini mastermind with a few other ladies. Love that. I will continue to use it that way. I support other businesses, whether they are selling flowers, baked goods, chiropractic care, whatever it might be.
I am always reaching out always making mention of them if I can, or letting them know behind the scenes through a private message. Hey, I just saw your post. That was really cool. You know, I just want, you know, I see you. That's sort of a thing. And that has the ROI on that because that's free has been massive.
I would say 75 percent of my business is coming from.
Melissa: So coming from referrals because you have worked on that, really.
Kim: Absolutely. I still have zero consistency in my social media. I've started to look at some of my stats because, on a side note, I did this random thing on Christmas Day, sitting on the couch.
Now, please keep in mind, again, and I've mentioned this every year, my middle daughter is in social media marketing, works for an agency in New York City, and zero time for mom. Zero time. And that's fine. I've accepted it. I've moved on. Here we are. Christmas day, I'm sitting there. We did this very obnoxious hat exchange as a family on Christmas Eve.
There was like 22 of us. It was very vulgar. I actually lost some people, but that's fine. That's fine. It was on your social media and it was
Melissa: I found it hysterical, but I know it's maybe not for everybody.
Kim: No, it wasn't for everybody, but we had so much fun doing it. So I just wanted to like put a little thing together.
And it went crazy viral. It's still climbing. I think we're at like almost 3 million views. Anyway, even even the owner of the hat company reached out and thanked me and said, next time you have an event, let me know I'll supply the hats there. It was so hilarious, but it did nothing for my business.
And so that's why I think it's really important for people to understand what is your objective. Within your social media. So, yes, I had a viral video, but it did zero for me. Absolutely zero. All it does is blow my Instagram up all day long. Every, like, every 15 minutes. So, it was fun, though. I had fun doing it.
Melissa: I was just about to say, which, by the way, that by itself, let's just take that into a microcosm. That's fun to have that happen, right? Like, It's it's fun. It connects you with random people, probably across the world. You are never going to get any business out of it more than likely. But it's fun to have that as its own singular thing.
Absolutely. Different to the point is you can't constantly be trying. First of all, people who try to go viral, don't go viral like things that go viral, right? They're accidental. But the thing that you try at and the thing that does get you business from your social media is that concentrated personal work by reaching out to other local businesses.
And that is something that is totally different. And that's a great use of social media. I think the difference is yeah. That people are constantly trying to say, like, oh, if I got a video that got 3,000,000 views, I'm gonna have business out the wazoo. And that's not right. The result of that those things are mutually exclusive.
Kim: Exactly. They really are. But it could have been very exciting for me if I was selling maybe a digital program, but I am not selling a digital program. So for me the followers that I did get from it and those people probably wouldn't even have bought a digital program anyway. Yeah, it just, it just made me really realize that yeah, there is a separation when it comes to all the, these like going viral in this and that it's, it just depends on what you're selling. So for me, that's not going to help my organizing business. In fact, my stats, most of the people are on the East coast seeing it and in other countries.
Melissa: right. Yeah. So you can just enjoy that for what it is completely separated from what is it actually going to do for my business. And that's, and that's a different process and all of that good stuff.
Kim: It is, and you know, I did find myself a little bit after it happened. Not necessarily trying to duplicate it, but like, oh, maybe I should just now I should just hop on like once or twice a day and I gave up after like 15 minutes.
It's a lot of work. It is.
Melissa: It's a lot of work. You know, I talked a lot about social media last year. I'm probably going to be talking about a lot more this year, but, one of the things that I'm always going to preach is it's sort of like people who think Marie Kondo wants everyone to get rid of everything they own.
And she's even said, that's not what I've said. That's not what I've ever said. I am not anti social media. I just want people to be realistic about if they really, really hate it and they are never going to do it and that's going to show, then you don't have to do it as a part of your business.
If you love doing it. If it really is something that you're like, I would like to spend the time and energy and effort to put into this and do it, please do it. I want people to do it. I want more fun things to see in my feed. Like, but it's about what exactly what you're saying. What are your goals?
What are you trying to get out of it?
Kim: Yeah. Find your avenue, find what you like and stick with it. And if that is social media, then you also need to really focus on what are you offering?
Melissa: Yes. That's important.
And tell us a little bit about, so your strategy on social, the five, we call it the five mile famous strategy, meeting the meeting actual people in your community, you know, supporting other businesses, what are some of the things that you've done?
I know you said you kind of dm people, but do you have a few tips that you can give people on?
Kim: Well, first of all, I do spend time scrolling and I purposefully stop when I see somebody that I know that lives in my area and I will like their post because that's what we should be doing. We should be helping them.
And I'll try and comment or I'll send them a message. Like I said, just a private message of something, I don't know, it could be anything. It could be acknowledging their post, or it could be something that came to mind that I thought of something else, or I also will tag people. I'll tag other people, like my daughter's getting married in August, so there's, you know, a lot of people in my area that do things that have to do with weddings, so I'll tag Courtney in it and just Say, hey, this may be for the wedding because that helps them as well, helps their all of that.
So I'm not just socializing and networking, I'm helping them. I want to help them. I want to make comments. I want to share. I want to save that kind of a thing because I know that that will help bring their page a little closer into the geographic area that it needs to.
Melissa: Yes. And, and I love that because you are genuinely reaching out to them.
And this is another hot button for me is I think that people sometimes are like, okay, I'm going to DM this person and then I'm going to go on a sales pitch. Like I'm giving them the sales pitch. Oh, yeah. No. Like you've got to create some authentic connection. And sorry, that's like, I hate authentic connection.
It's like such a gross phrase. Right. But it's true. Like, It's not about, okay, I'm just going to DM you. And I instantly want to give you my, my thing and say, this is what I do. And this is what I want to sell you. It's about actually creating a relationship with people.
Kim: Absolutely. And a lot of the times I will ask.
Somebody like if you ever want to meet for coffee, I would love to hear your story. I truly do want to hear people's stories. It helps inspire me. It helps get me to overcome some obstacles that might be in my way. I never try and pitch myself, I don't ever pitch myself ever.
They might ask me questions, and that's fine. But I really do try and keep it on a personal, make it a personal relationship. And I do that authentically. I'm not, I truly am not trying to snake my way in anywhere. I love now when I go places, I always see people I know, which is awesome. Aand people will stop me and ask me or, Oh, I'm, you know, I saw your story the other day.
That was so cool. I love what you did that to me. That to me is what social media has done for me and how it is still going to continue to be a part of my business. And at this point, I don't intend to grow it anymore or put any more effort into it.
Melissa: So I think a little extension of what your social media strategy has been.
Can you talk a little bit about networking? So one of the things that I did is I went back, and I so you and I have worked together for a long time. And one of the things I did is I went back through all of our texts from the last year. And one of the things that really stood out to me was you had sent me a screenshot.
Someone asked for an organizer and all of these people were like, Kim, Rustic Home Organizing, Kim, Rustic Home Organizing. Like you got recommended like five different times in one screenshot and you said, this is why I network. That was your text. So yes. Tell me a little bit more about that.
Kim: Yeah, and that bottom comment.
I remember that one. It was a community page, not one I live in, but one near me. And I think the bottom comment was it's clear we have a local organizer.
Melissa: Yeah, it was. It was just like that. Yeah, this is the clear winner. I think was the phrase.
Kim: Right. But then beyond that I make an effort to go to certain restaurants pubs that I know are probably it's a popular Friday night. I know probably quite a few people will be there. So I will make an effort to try and go, you know, if we're going to go, let's just go and at least try and make something more of it.
We can connect with people. Then I can see people. I can ask about people. I can connect also names with faces and and, Chad, he is as well, a small business owner. So it, it helps both of us, but I do that. I try and sponsor some of the sports teams, the young kids.
I go to any networking event that I'm invited to—if anybody invites me to, I was, went to one last night, which was amazing. The chamber, I still do chamber. I'm in a couple chambers.
And then I try and hold classes. That's also a way for me to network. I hold classes. I don't try and make money off these classes. I hold classes to make awareness to what we do as organizers, who I am, and what I'm willing to do for my local area.
And so those have also been a really great way for me to get my name out there and connect with people.
Melissa: But everything that you're saying takes work and it takes effort and it takes I, I know I, as I was joking last night, I had two different social events that I had to go to last night. And I was like, this is three more social events than I usually do on a weeknight.
Right? And and so for someone like me, who it's more of a stretch for me to, you know, go out and do it. There might be people that are like, oof, that sounds like a lot, but what you get in return is immeasurable.
Kim: Yes. And when I'm, anytime I'm invited to something, a party, an event, I really make effort to go not just for the networking part, that's a big part of it, but I'm also have obviously gained a relationship with somebody that they want me enough to be able to come to their event.
And I, you know, I want to respect that and realize that, that's all my hard work that got me that invitation, and I need to go and enjoy it. But very, very rarely does any of my networking ever have to do with pitching. I will have people say, “Oh my gosh, I thought of you the other day when I was cleaning my pantry.” and I’ll go, do you have a picture?
I do. Let me see. Oh, you'll look at it right now and we'll look at it and I'll just throw a few things out. But never am I pitching or trying to get into somebody's house.
Melissa: It's just planting the seeds. And that, that is it. That's all that needs to happen. And I think that we're constantly being sold now, constantly, we're going to talk about that in a little bit, but we are constantly being sold things on social media, in the world, on TV, on, you know, what, wherever we are, we're being sold something. And so even when you're just watching a TV show, like how many things are like, Oh, we're going to drive this Buick, whatever, whatever, you know? Like, yeah.
It's constant. So I think it's very refreshing when you are, in fact, not trying to sell people things. I just think that you are doing the right thing and planting the seeds and please do not go overboard on the selling part. As someone who gets constantly and often very poorly.
Kim: And you know, yes, we all get pitched and you just have to be so careful.
You could get pitched at the wrong moment.
Melissa: Yes. And you're, you're $1,000 in and you've got zero ROI on it. Or $10,000 in. That too.
Kim: I have not made that mistake yet. But. Yes. I can see how it's possible. I've come close.
Melissa: One of the things we talked about the last couple of years is confidence.
So the person that is sitting in front of me right now on this computer screen, two years ago, I think your confidence was like a negative four, right? And now you're like, I'm out talking to people. I'm doing presentations. I'm doing all of this. How did you build up to that?
Kim: Sure. My confidence journey has definitely been that, a journey, and it was very low when, when I started and it slowly built.
That first year was a slow build but I definitely gained a lot of momentum. And I think this year, actually, I went backwards a little bit second quarter. I actually had a moment of, I don't think I'm going to do this anymore. I need the consistent income, started applying for jobs and got an interview.
And then just changed my mind. My family, once again, talked to me off the ledge and that was in May. And then by June you and I've talked, I had June, July, August, September were my biggest months. I didn't even know were possible. So I had a little slip, but I would say that after that June. I was flying pretty high, probably a little too high.
Yeah. I think the adrenaline, I think everything just thought, oh, this can never slow down now.
Melissa: The phrase could be “you girl bossed too close to the sun.”
Kim: Yes. A little bit like that. Yes, exactly. And so, then I had in October, I was full. November, I was booked.
And, you know, I'm building a studio on my property, and I put a bunch of money into it over the summer thinking this was an endless supply coming in. And I had cancellation after cancellation in November, my November went dry. And I didn't my confidence got hit hard, not just my confidence in my clients, but the, my financial confidence got hit really hard.
And I'm glad it did because this year has been a little bit of a different focus for me. My word of the year is patience. And last year was intentional. But it helped ground me a little bit. But when I did get hit, I didn't get hit all the way back to negative four, I got just a quick bruise and I rebounded and I'm feeling more and more confident.
And I'm learning how to be confident even when the money and the clients aren't coming in. And I think that that is just something that's going to evolve. And I would say to new people just starting to not expect too much from yourself. But. That confidence, always working on your confidence is definitely going to help your business a hundred percent.
Melissa: I also think, so as I, the word that I wrote down when I was going through the text was actually whiplash, and here's why. Because I think you had some times where, like you said in May where you were like, that's it. I quit. And then later, you're like, I'm fully booked. I can't even talk to you.
I mean, I have the receipts. You guys like, I can't even talk to you. And then it is. And it was this hilarious progression of, you know, I, I'm at, I'm feeling really, really low. Wait a minute. I'm fully booked. Wait a minute. I just had my first $10,000 a month. And then there was a month where you were way above $10,000.
And, and then it was, I was fully booked and now I'm not.
There is some of that in businesses, peaks and valleys. And that is something that, and that can be a real hit to confidence. So I think the cool thing that I've seen with you is, is that you don't take the peaks and valleys as seriously personally. So the peaks and valleys are happening, but you're a little bit steadier through the peaks and valleys, if that makes sense.
Kim: Yes, it does, and that's a really great way to put it, and I think that to anybody starting out, to not expect that of yourself right out the chute. You've got to allow yourself to get some calluses and I can see now why a lot of businesses fail after the second, first, second year because it's a mind game.
There are so many moving parts and so many things to navigate and work through. So yes, my confidence is getting bolder because I am able to see each obstacle as a learning opportunity and for me to gain an even stronger foundation moving into the next year.
Melissa: What do you think that you will feel like this year, so we're in 2024—do you feel like you're ever going to get to a point where you're like, I got it.
I've nailed it.
Kim: I'm always going to be figuring things out. I would like to say. I'll get it, like, just, it'll just work on its own, but it evolves. It's going to constantly have to evolve. And I'm going to have to change things that I do and my approaches and the way I network might have to change.
It's always going to take a pivot to keep the business going. It's not just going to autopilot forever. And there's lots of programs out there that will tell you that you can autopilot your business for a lot of money and you will make $100,000 a month and I'm sorry, but for, for anybody to think that you only have to work two hours a week or three hours a week or half hour a day, it’s not realistic.
Melissa: And you can force your way through, I mean—I do think that's a good point of, there are definitely ways you can run your business where you say I can really only devote three hours a day to it. Cool. Well, then here are here's the reality of what three hours a day looks like versus there's the reality of five hours a day or there are organizers that due to schedules or due to kids can say, you know, I can only take one client a week.
That's all I can do. Then there have been people that have come to me before and said, well, I can only do two sessions a week, but I want to make six figures a year. The math ain't mathing. You have to build a team or you have to do like there, there are always if you have certain goals, then what you have to, what it takes to achieve those, you know, you're going to have to do some work differently, I think is, and there are plenty of people in this business who have little kids, they just have to work differently. They might have to work after they go to bed or before they wake up or while they're napping, or it's just a different way to work.
Kim: And if there are people making 100k a month working 3 hours a week, there's a backstory going on that, that I, there's, there's more to the big picture.
So there's definitely some traps to be aware of. And like I said, fortunately, I haven't fallen into any huge traps. I've fallen into some small ones, but and it's really, it's really important for me to stay on track when I do have a downer day yesterday, I had a downer day and man, I kept thinking, Oh, that one person that does marketing, I bet she could just fix all this for me.
You know, it's worth the $5,000. I'll just do it.
Melissa: Here's my experience. Everybody can take it or leave it. Because I have been in very expensive programs and I have been in very inexpensive programs and, and everything in between. And Jen, who's the founder of Pro Organizer Studio, would tell you the same thing.
She's been in very, very, very expensive programs. I know people who have been in $25,000 programs and people who have been in $200 programs. This is a weird thing, but the more you pay for a program, often the less you get in return. The person that I know that was in a $25,000 program, I just remember her saying, I spent all this money and I got more out of doing one, you know, Inspired Organizer for $997.
And this was long before I was involved with Pro Organizer Studio. This is not a sales pitch, but—some of those huge, huge expensive big ticket programs, you think, “Oh, this is going to solve all of my problems.” And in fact, it, it solves very, they solve very few problems.
Kim: That is true. And I know we've kind of segued into this, maybe prematurely, but, and this is, you did not ask me to give a plug to Pro Organizer Studio, but what I will say about Pro Organizer Studio, when I found it was on YouTube.
It was not on social media, it was on YouTube, and I watched video after video after video. I listened and I thought, okay, it wasn't off a pretty picture made on Canva with a five second reel. It was video after video after video. It was emails to you asking questions and it was a dollar amount, not monthly, not yearly.
It was a dollar amount and you're in, and you could just have this. It's ongoing community, and that, to me, is what buying a course online should be. I mean, that's my opinion but I think there's just a lot to be aware of out there for a lot of promising and under delivering and overpricing, especially on the social media Instagram train.
Melissa: It's so, so, so easy now to have. And I mean, we all fall in this trap. I'm a very cynical person because I know from the inside, like what some of these programs are and what some of the people are. And like I'm, and I am a big proponent of—by the way, if you're thinking about one of my programs, ask me a lot of questions and hammer me with questions about what are your credentials and what, what are you going to teach me?
And what are you going to give me and make sure that I'm going to deliver the thing that you need. But it is so, so simple for someone to just put a shingle out on Instagram and give you all sorts of things. The one thing that I see in my feet a lot. Are people that are trying to sell me on like, I made a million dollars last year selling courses, and I only worked two hours a day, sort of like what you're saying earlier.
And I'm like, show me the receipts. I want to see that. I want to see the tax return that says you made a million dollars last year. I could tell you I made a million dollars last year. That does not mean that it's true.
Kim: Exactly. I also feel like Instagram is kind of, you know, when you go to Disneyland and everything is triple the price, like, a soda is like 12, but you get the cool little souvenir cup.
Yeah, I almost feel like that's what Instagram is. There are people that will do your books for you. They'll do other things for you, but they have this Instagram price tag on them. There's a lot of caution to be put out there on a lot of these things, and if you are interested in a certain professional service, and you're attracted to it on Instagram, take some time, do some research, and see locally, is there somebody in my local area that can help me, so I'm not just having this person over here in who knows what state, I And if she's actually doing anything or not.
So, yeah, but again, that personal connection is really important to me. So if I'm going to hire anybody, I've got to talk to him. I've got to see him. I need to, we need to have all the conversations.
Melissa: and just asking questions.
Kim: Just yeah, a lot of questions,
Melissa: make sure that you know what you're getting and that goes for anything that goes for any service.
I'm not just talking about coaching services, but I would like people that want to hire me for organizing. I had a woman the other day who drilled me with questions and it was really funny too. I was actually laughing about this with my family. I'm sure they'd be thrilled that I was telling this story, but one of the things she said is well, I just need to know that you're comfortable working with people who have anxiety.
And I'm like, girl, I live with a whole house full, So, I'm not going to say bye. Bye. people. But asking her questions, especially if you're about to spend a lot of money, is, I think, incredibly important.
Kim: Yeah. And another piece to all of that is and we even do it in our in our community—we talk about, you know, raise your prices, raise your prices. Yes. I agree that you need to figure out what your market is, and price accordingly, but I also caution to not overprice. Do not overprice yourself. Don't put a price tag on yourself that you aren't ready for because that will backfire.
And I, I have found myself I came close to inflating myself more than I needed to because I got stuck on it train of something, but I reeled it back in. I did raise my rates, but I raised them to what comparable organizers are doing. I don't have anybody near me. I have some like 45 minutes away, but not overpricing yourself for your community as well, depending on your community.
I mean, I guess there's going to be some areas where you can do that, but…
Melissa: there is a sweet spot of pricing. And the thing that I will always say about pricing is that I am going to tell you to raise your prices because underpricing themselves so dramatically. Like if you're pricing $40 or $50 an hour.
I mean, and I don't care where you live. There are very few communities that you can argue with me can't support at least $75 an hour for an organizer. But I totally agree with you. There becomes a time where you're like, okay, let's also be realistic.
You know, like, yes, Gucci is allowed to charge $6,000 for a purse. The number of people who have those purses, it's very, very small. We need to be smart about how we're pricing. And there is a sweet spot of you can get a client, your ideal clientele and do very well financially and be able to cover all the things you need to cover. But not lose everybody for sure.
Tell us a little bit about your pricing journey because I know that's, that's something that you've gone back and forth on.
So give me the good, bad, the ugly of, of the pricing journey.
Kim: Well, first my pricing started with a dozen eggs and I think you scolded me for that, but that's okay. Were they good eggs though? Of course, they're fresh eggs. They were pretty too. They were like blue and brown. Anyway my pricing journey, I started off thinking I was worth a lot more than I was.
I thought I was going to be charging I'll just throw dollar figures out there. That's kind of my other thing this year is we don't talk about money enough. I totally agree with you. I totally agree with you. We need to. So I thought I could start off at 125 an hour. I just thought, that's what I can make.
And I remember you asking me, how are you going to feel when you say that to your first client? And I remember saying, not good. I don't know if it'll even be able to come out of my mouth. And so you said, what sounds good to you? What can you confidently say? What can you say about backing off of it? And my first thought was $55.
But what came out of my mouth was $75. And to be honest with you, those first three months, probably should have been $55. But I did do an intro rate, I reached out to quite a few people I knew that said, Hey, if you have anything you want done 50 bucks an hour. So I probably should have just had that. On my website from the beginning, but I didn't and then I found myself those first few months in business.
I would go onto my website, change it $65, change it $75. Nobody probably ever saw me going back and forth, but you could see that there was, I was playing mind games with myself. And I finally stuck with $75 an hour for my first year. And then I stayed $75. I got cocky once and raised it to $125 again, not telling anybody. I just went onto my website. And lost sleep, so the next morning, popped on there, moved it back down. And then I made an announcement in October after I had such a great summer.
I did some number crunching and how much time I had put in, and I looked at other organizers and talked to other local organizers.
Which again, that's another thing you've gotta make friends with your people. And they were all at least a hundred dollars an hour. And so I decided I was going to a hundred dollars an hour, but I was also bringing on a second organizer when needed, and that was where I struggled because, you know, I'm hourly, I don't do packages and so I struggled with that a little bit but ultimately I started actually in October with new clients. My past clients started in January. I'm $100 an hour and then I am $75 an hour for my second organizer. So I'm $175 an hour when there's two of us and we bust ass. We work hard, and we get through so much, and I will only bring a second organizer on if I know double the work is going to happen.
I will not bring one on if it's just sitting with, I have a couple 70 year old clients, and if I'm just sitting with them decluttering their clothes, I will not bring a second organizer on. Yeah. Unless she can be doing something else. Like 100 percent on our own doing something else. And that is the only way I will bring on two organizers.
I prefer to work alone, but there are some projects that who just gets it done faster. And I will say two weeks ago I went on my website and I raised my price to $125 and I brought it right back. I love it.
Melissa: You're just like, it's like you're just like taking the baby steps and you're like, Oop, I gotta walk back. No.
Kim: It didn't feel good. Yeah, I was, I was crawling out of my skin and I think part of it to Melissa is I don't, I want to be attainable for as many people as possible. I don't want to be so expensive that I can't still help people or people think that they can't. They can't afford me. And at some point, if I need to make more money, then I have to find a different way to make more money instead of just gouging people's pockets.
I mean, it's just, I'm not an attorney. And if I get to the point where I'm charging attorney prices, to me, that's just, that just isn't right.
Melissa: I've had a couple clients recently. I'm $100 an hour as well. And I've had a couple clients recently who've been very upfront of like, I can only afford 3 hours.Is that okay?
And I'm always like, absolutely. We will get so much done in that 3 hours. I'm really committed to those people because those are the people that I think really appreciate our services very, very much. And but these are people that they couldn't afford to have their whole house done, but they can afford us for a certain period of time.
And I think that's important is we do not have to charge $50 an hour for our services. We're allowed to charge $100 an hour for our services. Many people are able to make that investment without it being, again, they're not going to be whole house clients, but they will still be able to make that investment with you for a period of time and have that be attainable for them and for you as a business owner.
Kim: And I think the key word there is investment. Most of the people that I do that for as well because you know, I am hourly, I don't require you to buy a certain amount of hours. They're so empowered after we've done three or four hours Usually it gets them enough momentum to start doing things on their own.
And then maybe two months later, three months later, they'll call me back for just three more hours. And that is just really great to see people doing things on their own. And it's important message that I really want to try and get across this year is to let people know that you don't have to have an organizer come in and just, it doesn't have to be start to finish.
I mean, you could have an interior designer come into your house and just have you tweak your living room, and it's going to inspire you and it's going to give you this excitement to start working over in this corner over here on your own. As an organizer, we can do the exact same thing.
And I also have noticed this trend of every organizer thinking they need to have a team. And there are, I think that is great. If you have figured out the business model and you have the clientele and you have the bandwidth to manage all of that, by all means. A hundred percent, but I do believe that there is a place for teams and there is a place for solo organizers and finding out which one you are is important.
I automatically thought I had to do a team and I thought this summer with all the business I had, I was going to have to do a team, but I quickly realized that. I don't want that. I do want to have a second person that I can call in that I trust and I have that, but I don't want a team.
I don't want to manage a team. I still want to be able to do one on one with the clients that I attract and the ones that I have the most fulfillment with.
Melissa: This is one thing I feel so, so strongly about is this is another one that I just think we get a little poison from social media is we have this view that in order to be successful, you have to do blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, like you constantly have to be growing, you constantly have to, you know, if you start to get booked out, then you have to build a team of 12 people.
And then, I will shout it from the mountaintops. You need to know yourself more than anything else. And like we said earlier, there are trade offs to everything. So if you want to make $250,000 a year as an organizer, you are going to have to figure out team dynamics. But if you know yourself and I know myself.
I like working by myself. I like being a solo organizer because that's what I prefer. Those are the clients I prefer to work with. I like getting into the psychology. Not everybody does. I like getting into the Hey, I can do this project on my own. That works for me. It might sound terrible to someone listening to this who's like, oof, I don't want to do that.
That sounds awful. You have got to know yourself and then be honest about this is, how I want to build my business. There is no one path to do it. Your path is not my path is not the person next to me. You've got to know what works for you and you cannot be swayed by what everyone else is doing.
Because I will always argue, you never know what someone else is actually doing.
Kim: You don't, you don't. And, and I'm going to, like I said, I'm going to continue to do the way I am. I love that if I decide I, I have a certain amount of hours every month that I try and achieve. And if I want to clump those into two weeks and take two weeks off, then I can.
And I can change that whole thinking the next month. I can spread it all out. I can't do that if I have a team and I have other people that are relying on me. And I, I just have found that that's just way too important for me. I make it very personal and like, we just had all this ice and I'm working with, like I said, a couple older ladies and, I called them, made sure they, do you need anything? Because we have vehicles that we can get around in. I can go to the store for you. I mean, of course I'm not charging them, just making sure that they're good.
And they love that. And then we just, yeah, I care for them. I really care for them. I care for my clients a lot. I really do. And the ones that I don't, they're not my clients.
Melissa: And I will also say that so you and I are similar in terms of how we approach some of the, a lot of things with our clients. You might be listening to this and going, that sounds like the worst thing I've ever heard.
I don't ever want to hear from my client after the time we're together. You know, I am not buying my client groceries. I am not like that is also totally fine. And you can also say, I am going to charge $200 an hour because I only want to work in $3 million and up homes every, but there is a spot in this industry for everyone and every way to work.
And there are some people who hate doing decluttering and there are some people who hate a messy basement. And I would rather not make a beautiful pantry. And there are people that think I'm crazy for that. So there is room for all of us.
Kim: There really is, and I love that and I just, I really want all new organizers coming into this to know that.
I also want them to take it seriously because it's a really empowering job and it's important to take it seriously and give it the time, the attention and the skill that it needs. This is not easy money. No, it doesn't take a lot to start this business, but it's really important to know the impact that this industry does have on people's lives and to make sure that We keep it that way.
And it's just really important for me to make sure I get that point across.
So anybody that ever reaches out to me that I talked to, that's one of the first things I tell them is to understand, just take away all the product and the print, just forget all that. Do you, are you ready to walk into somebody's house, talk to them, sit with their, them on the floor in their dog hair?
Are you ready to fold their underwear in front of them? Are you ready to hear about how mad they are at their husband? Are you ready to see them cry? Are you ready to hear them cuss? Yeah. There's so much that goes along with it and, and which is why we can charge what we charge.
Melissa: Yeah, absolutely. And that's another example of knowing yourself and knowing the kind of work that we do.
And there are people like my client that the example that I gave of the client is like, Are you prepared to work with someone's anxiety? That might be someone that you're like, Oh, actually, I'm not interested in that then have a referral network of people. Who can do that and have that referral network built up so that you could say, I think I have the perfect person for you.
And I would love to help you, but I actually want you to get the exact help you need. And here's that person.
Kim: That is so true. And that's another reason why I say you need to reach out to your other organizers in your area. If you don't have anybody really close by, it is still so important. And they might pull you in. There's two around here that I really like. Michelle and Ashley, they both have different companies and Michelle brought me in on one of her jobs to help in November when my schedule got kind of weird and that was great. And she was an open book about things. We talked about things.
And I've referred a client to her that I just knew wasn't a fit for me. And then there's the other gal, Ashley. She has a little bit of an upscale. She levels up. She has her contractor's license. It's really cool. Oh, that's so cool. So anybody that just, I know is going to need just that extra.
Even though I have Chad in my back pocket, he runs his own business. I don't give those to her. So, whereas if somebody out this area reaches out to them, they are not driving out here. They're going to call me. So yeah, reach out.
Melissa: I have a very treasured client who I have been working with her for many years.
I love her. She loves me. We do a project together every few months. She'll just say like, Hey, I need a refresh, whatever. I worked with her dad one time. And he was a, an. He could not be more different than she is. And I like to be as flexible as possible. And I work with a lot of different personalities.
But I have a similar way of working to you, which is, I work fast. I had a client one time that's like, you work like a demon. And I go, thank you. That's a compliment. But I, you know, and by the way, I can flex when I need to, but in general, I feel pretty strongly that I want to get as much work done as possible.
That was too fast for this client's dad. And she was very, very upfront with me. She's like, I love you. You're exactly perfect for me. You weren't perfect for my dad. Could you recommend someone? It did not hurt my feelings. I was not sad. I was like, I'm glad that you were able to say to me, hey, could you help me find someone for me?
Because I care about her and I care about her dad. I want him to be able to find someone. So I lovely have two people in the Twin Cities that I'm like, I think these two personalities could be perfect for working with him. Boom. Here you go again. Our feelings. I want everyone to be happy and I'm not everyone's cup of tea.
And that's okay. I'm definitely not everyone's cup of tea. I might not even be the cup of tea of people who are listening to this podcast. I hope I am.
Kim: I mean, I'm set in my ways. I, I am who I am and that's just not gonna change. And being in this business and being a business owner last two years has given me that empowerment to be able to say that that's just who I am and everything I'm saying today, not everybody's going to agree with, and I'm not saying that my way is the way.
It's just the, the one I have navigated and it is the one that I think others might align with and it might help them in their business journey—is that I can now get on there and I can piece together an email and I can get it sent out.
No, all the links might not work. No, it might not be pretty, but I can do that. And now I can go on to a blog. Thanks to you. You have helped me with these two things, but I can go on and I can create a blog and I don't overthink the blog. Now, if I want to talk about something that really isn't even organizing related, I just do that.
It's getting that consistency, getting yourself to do that action, and I think then it just will get better in time, just like my networking, just like my organizing. Everything will just get better in time.
Melissa: Practice. And that's all there is to it. Yeah. So I know the answer to this but could the person that I talked to in January of 2022 imagine the person that you are right now?
Kim: Absolutely not. No freaking way, if you would have told me at the end of year two. What I would have done like the money that I made in year one versus the money I made in year two and the growth in my confidence and just people knowing about me, knowing what I do the people I've met, the relationships I've made starting to build a studio on my property.
I mean, it's crazy. Absolutely nuts. Absolutely.
Melissa: Hope you're proud of yourself.
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